I guess I'm part of "Tozzer's angry masses," but i'm not angry, i'm asking questions. And the questions are not being answered, which leads to suspicion. I am suspicious.
I moved here from Chicago 5 years ago. What I learned from living in Crook County for 60 years is ALWAYS be SUSPICIOUS of the government because 9 out of 10 times it’s all about money and power
Just because we show up to vote, we are a mob. The very people who mourn the "lose of democracy" at all of these protest rallies really don't want democracy. They are so self-absorbed that they can't handle transparency, accountability, facts, and public scrutiny. Gimme, gimme, gimme is all they know. So, yes, we are upset and we want truthful answers to obvious questionable actions. People get upset when their hard working dollars are misused and dissolved into a money pit with no accountable outcome. No one likes being used for deceptive purposes.
Ms. Johnson was so defensive, it looks like to me that there might be some truth hidden in her "rant," the code of conduct should include "Avoid temptation to respond to negative comments with negative responses."
The deck is stacked! In Eastern Washington piping and covering irrigation ditches makes sense because of evaporation. In Sequim, non-piping and thus aquifer restoration makes sense. I'm surprised the SG even published the letter from the resident in the Agnew Irrigation District. IMO the PDN, SG, and radio stations are NOT interested in investigative reporting on issues and giving a voice to alternative views. The gut says that no matter these meetings that are on the calendar - you will see this $5 tax on the November ballot. "Let the public be DAMNED". Don't you just love mail-in voting?
Hey; it's only $ 5 - - - and the hits just keep a comin. "Governance" has become a parasite that kills it's host. The problem is there are no other hosts available. If one works hard and long enough to buy their own property, they become the primary funding source for the services provided to those who do not own property. We are punishing hard work and responsibility. As Geoff Fox points out, piping ground water when you live in the shadow of a huge water source and the climate is temperate MAKES NO SENSE.
When the low-level dictator criminals in our local government play these obviously underhanded dishonest and completely unconstitutional games to keep milking the good folks for money in our community and continue to steal our rights & freedoms, yes, they can obviously expect to be confronted by angry folks who object to their actions that "we" never agreed to nor wanted~! That is just the way this is going to go, regardless of their continued threats and constant bullying tactics. In fact, these criminals who constantly threaten and bully the good folks in our community, can fully expect that they will in turn receive even more threats of their removal from office and criminal prosecutions~! I am very proud of the good folks in our community, many here on The Watchdog, who are taking a stand against this long history of abuses by the criminals in our local government~! We shall NOT be treated like petulant children, by these scumbags who for some completely insane reason wrongly believe that they are in office to "lead" people. I COMPLETELY reject their term and definition of their own misconception of their "leadership roles". These criminals in our local government ONLY work for us as public servants, NOT as our bosses, "parents", or superiors who have any right to dictate the direction of our community~! I really don't know who these idiots think they are or where they get the perverted notion that they can tell the good folks what to do, how to live, or what to think, but if they really want to have the support of the majority of folks in our community they definitely know exactly what they need to do. Cease and desist with their socialist (clearly evil satanic) behavior and start to abide by the oaths that they took right now, which obviously includes being completely fiscally competent and completely respecting our human and property rights~! Nothing less will be tolerated and the consequences for their continued criminal behavior, even if it is "legal" but not LAWFUL, will become increasingly more severe should they continue along this disgusting path of dictatorship rule~!
Most people do not understand how important this issue is.
The long range planning of "no til" farming is not healthy for America. The premise of "no til" farming is to leave the bug cycle in place. The tilling breaks up the bug cycle. Hence the term no til. Hence the need for chemically engineered genetics.
Gates/Monsanto et all want chemical and engineered farming. They do not want farming in minerals. They had minerals galore in the Dungeness/Agnew. Now, they have farmed out "no til" soil that does not grow healthy food. We need minerals in our soil. The rivers bring it to the farms. Now, even the existing farm systems has no mineral distribution. Now Skagit, Snohomish, Dungeness and Yakima/Mabton are under siege.
I can't believe the Tribes are going along with this. Its shocking.
The water rights for the tribes are not in the treaty as Jeff said. They are derived from over reaching judicial interpretation, in my opinion without having read them, of the Boldt Decision. They are “poisoned fruit.” Why? Let’s overturn Boldt.
The Travesty And Tragedy That Is The Boldt Decision, Part 1
Judge Boldt stacked the deck to get the outcome he desired. I leave it to you to ponder his motive(s). Central to his finding were: (1). The Indians negotiating the treaty were an "unlettered people." Primitive and dependant were also used. (2). The language barrier was unfair. English, which was "unknown to most of the tribal representatives," was used. Translations were "by an interpreter in the service of the United States using Chinook Jargon, which was also unknown to some tribal representatives. Having only about three hundred words in its vocabulary, the Jargon was capable of conveying only rudimentary concepts, but not the sophisticated or implied meaning of treaty provisions about which highly learned jurists and scholars differ."
However, in 1974, the only words in dispute in any treaty provision for Boldt really were "in common." Boldt wrote, "There is no indication that the Indians intended or understood the language "in common with all citizens of the Territory" to limit their right to fish in any way." From other case law, he extracted,(from which I extracted) "... the negotiations for the treaty are conducted, on the part of the United States, an enlightened and powerful nation, by representatives skilled in diplomacy, masters of a written language, understanding the modes and forms of creating the various technical estates known to their law, ..."
The concept of "the commons" is the "sophisticated or implied meaning" and "various technical estates" of concern to Boldt.
Seems to me the concept of The Common was developed by primitive unlettered people that weren't dependent on enlightened nations, representatives skilled in diplomacy, masters of a written language, or understanding modes and forms of creating various technical estates. The Common is an essential part of any group any time in the history of man. When the first people gathered around a fire to cook, share and exchange their food and stories of the hunt and the days adventures, to find a mate, to make friends, etc., there was a common, and there were rules of behavior for all.
Even children understand the concept. They know the difference between mom and dad's bedroom and the kitchen on one hand and the bath, dining, family, and living rooms on the other. When they first are on the playground at school, they learn to share the slide, merry-go-round, and swings in common with the other children. They quickly learn the common has rules. (Did I just uncover the real reason why playgrounds can't have such wonderful things anymore?). Are such children lettered?
The limitations of the Chinook language are too important to Boldt. He does not mention sign language. Have you ever played "Charades" or just watched others. Lots of information can be conveyed. How hard is it to point at everyone present for the treaty and make a big sweeping inclusive motion? Many Indians had seen explorers' ships and even the explorers since 1805 when Lewis and Clark came as far as Astoria. A fort was built there in 1813. There were numerous settlers in Seattle, Olympia, and probably elsewhere years before the treaty was signed in 1855. How much English did some Indians already know? I suspect more than Boldt and the plaintifs want us to believe.
Surely, the Indians must have recognized the fact that the reservation was their designated common area just for them. Shouldn't that make it obvious to them that the rest was the common area for everyone else and them? How difficult is that to see? It follows naturally and logically. I don't see the Indians as so primitive that this would be difficult for them.
Indians always talk about how their elders are wise and how much they honor and respect them. Yet, some 120 years after the signing, some unhappy tribal members were willing and anxious to throw their ancestors under the bus, and Judge Boldt swallowed.
Article 10 of the treaty makes a lie of the whole case. The tribes were desirous of alcohol prohibition on the reservations. This is all the evidence needed to conclude they knew what The Common was and it needed rules to protect it.
Article 9 also has something about The Common shared by all. Two rules for the Indians when on the joint commons: be friendly and respect property.
Question? Before there were irrigation ditches for farming, where, how, was the water table in Sequim Valley and town rechraged, naturally? I have understood from books, lectures, and stories that it used to be a desert in the dry season. It would seem logical to me that if farmers and residents irrigate that that would recharge the subsurface water table as well as use of home wells and septic systems. Borrowing from the creek and river to give trees and veggies a drink (farming) should use only a portion of the water that we give to plants and bathe in, and the rest goes back into the ground, sort of redistribution of the water . Not so? Metering wells and water use to keep track of the source and use seems smart to me,. Is there an amount of water that irrigators can take or totally unregulated? That sounds bad. How about a factual news article about these uses.
My Great Grandfather and a few others brought the water from the river to the valley back in the 1800's and I am sad to see what is happening to the open ditches? And all you newbys need to study the history of this valley and its growth?
I'd ask that you educate the masses here where more can learn than individually trying to track down the history if that makes sense. The perspectives you have likely aren't documented anywhere.
I have always asked: How is it wasting water if the water seeps back into the ground and is filtered down to the water table, or is evaporated into the atmosphere to become precipitation? If you want to "go green" you need to "grow green."
The irrigation ditches from a "alluvium"/ mineral distribution standpoint were the backbone of our grandparents food supply. Now we have genetically altered crops grown in "no til" farms. Our bodies immune system requires minerals. The best way to cull a population, is to control the food and take out the things our immune system needs so we can get sicker and have no defenses for the worst they can engineer in a lab.
If clallam county is going to continue to invent new groups like charter review,conservation,water districts,water stewardship,ect ect ect then you can bet these groups will come up with new permits and raised fee's to pass their time.
While living in Eastern Washington subscribed to and read the Capital Press. Back then, a decade ago, the worry was that the Odessa subarea aquifer was being drained due to heavy agricultural demand for water combined with a lack of rainfall, "the well is running dry folks". Just read a report that a META datacenter (built in Georgia) uses about 500,000 gallons of water a day. "Water, water, everywhere and not a drop to drink." Nor a drop for our crops/gardens? Maybe there is an opportunity for the community (no, not a politically partisan water steward) as a whole to forge a plan. I think the Sunny Farms store has its farm area in the Odessa Aquifer area.
I guess I'm part of "Tozzer's angry masses," but i'm not angry, i'm asking questions. And the questions are not being answered, which leads to suspicion. I am suspicious.
I moved here from Chicago 5 years ago. What I learned from living in Crook County for 60 years is ALWAYS be SUSPICIOUS of the government because 9 out of 10 times it’s all about money and power
Just because we show up to vote, we are a mob. The very people who mourn the "lose of democracy" at all of these protest rallies really don't want democracy. They are so self-absorbed that they can't handle transparency, accountability, facts, and public scrutiny. Gimme, gimme, gimme is all they know. So, yes, we are upset and we want truthful answers to obvious questionable actions. People get upset when their hard working dollars are misused and dissolved into a money pit with no accountable outcome. No one likes being used for deceptive purposes.
They use “democracy” as a dogwhistle for socialism.
Ms. Johnson was so defensive, it looks like to me that there might be some truth hidden in her "rant," the code of conduct should include "Avoid temptation to respond to negative comments with negative responses."
The deck is stacked! In Eastern Washington piping and covering irrigation ditches makes sense because of evaporation. In Sequim, non-piping and thus aquifer restoration makes sense. I'm surprised the SG even published the letter from the resident in the Agnew Irrigation District. IMO the PDN, SG, and radio stations are NOT interested in investigative reporting on issues and giving a voice to alternative views. The gut says that no matter these meetings that are on the calendar - you will see this $5 tax on the November ballot. "Let the public be DAMNED". Don't you just love mail-in voting?
You must be hitting a nerve, Jeff, if they’re trying to silence you (us).
More environmental socialists musing at how much good they could do if only they had more money.
Make the Tribe pay the parcel tax, since all of this is so they can wantonly decimate the salmon schools.
As for "code of conduct" at the CCD meeting, is bringing buckets of tar and feathers acceptable? Asking for a friend.
Fee. Word is they will. Final word he knows not.
Hey; it's only $ 5 - - - and the hits just keep a comin. "Governance" has become a parasite that kills it's host. The problem is there are no other hosts available. If one works hard and long enough to buy their own property, they become the primary funding source for the services provided to those who do not own property. We are punishing hard work and responsibility. As Geoff Fox points out, piping ground water when you live in the shadow of a huge water source and the climate is temperate MAKES NO SENSE.
Soon the jackboots will have 40 percent of your income.
Where do I sign up for Jeff’s angry masses? Questions evidently need to be answered. If people are upset you have to ask why?
When the low-level dictator criminals in our local government play these obviously underhanded dishonest and completely unconstitutional games to keep milking the good folks for money in our community and continue to steal our rights & freedoms, yes, they can obviously expect to be confronted by angry folks who object to their actions that "we" never agreed to nor wanted~! That is just the way this is going to go, regardless of their continued threats and constant bullying tactics. In fact, these criminals who constantly threaten and bully the good folks in our community, can fully expect that they will in turn receive even more threats of their removal from office and criminal prosecutions~! I am very proud of the good folks in our community, many here on The Watchdog, who are taking a stand against this long history of abuses by the criminals in our local government~! We shall NOT be treated like petulant children, by these scumbags who for some completely insane reason wrongly believe that they are in office to "lead" people. I COMPLETELY reject their term and definition of their own misconception of their "leadership roles". These criminals in our local government ONLY work for us as public servants, NOT as our bosses, "parents", or superiors who have any right to dictate the direction of our community~! I really don't know who these idiots think they are or where they get the perverted notion that they can tell the good folks what to do, how to live, or what to think, but if they really want to have the support of the majority of folks in our community they definitely know exactly what they need to do. Cease and desist with their socialist (clearly evil satanic) behavior and start to abide by the oaths that they took right now, which obviously includes being completely fiscally competent and completely respecting our human and property rights~! Nothing less will be tolerated and the consequences for their continued criminal behavior, even if it is "legal" but not LAWFUL, will become increasingly more severe should they continue along this disgusting path of dictatorship rule~!
Sincerely, Mike
Most people do not understand how important this issue is.
The long range planning of "no til" farming is not healthy for America. The premise of "no til" farming is to leave the bug cycle in place. The tilling breaks up the bug cycle. Hence the term no til. Hence the need for chemically engineered genetics.
Gates/Monsanto et all want chemical and engineered farming. They do not want farming in minerals. They had minerals galore in the Dungeness/Agnew. Now, they have farmed out "no til" soil that does not grow healthy food. We need minerals in our soil. The rivers bring it to the farms. Now, even the existing farm systems has no mineral distribution. Now Skagit, Snohomish, Dungeness and Yakima/Mabton are under siege.
I can't believe the Tribes are going along with this. Its shocking.
The water rights for the tribes are not in the treaty as Jeff said. They are derived from over reaching judicial interpretation, in my opinion without having read them, of the Boldt Decision. They are “poisoned fruit.” Why? Let’s overturn Boldt.
The Travesty And Tragedy That Is The Boldt Decision, Part 1
Judge Boldt stacked the deck to get the outcome he desired. I leave it to you to ponder his motive(s). Central to his finding were: (1). The Indians negotiating the treaty were an "unlettered people." Primitive and dependant were also used. (2). The language barrier was unfair. English, which was "unknown to most of the tribal representatives," was used. Translations were "by an interpreter in the service of the United States using Chinook Jargon, which was also unknown to some tribal representatives. Having only about three hundred words in its vocabulary, the Jargon was capable of conveying only rudimentary concepts, but not the sophisticated or implied meaning of treaty provisions about which highly learned jurists and scholars differ."
However, in 1974, the only words in dispute in any treaty provision for Boldt really were "in common." Boldt wrote, "There is no indication that the Indians intended or understood the language "in common with all citizens of the Territory" to limit their right to fish in any way." From other case law, he extracted,(from which I extracted) "... the negotiations for the treaty are conducted, on the part of the United States, an enlightened and powerful nation, by representatives skilled in diplomacy, masters of a written language, understanding the modes and forms of creating the various technical estates known to their law, ..."
The concept of "the commons" is the "sophisticated or implied meaning" and "various technical estates" of concern to Boldt.
Seems to me the concept of The Common was developed by primitive unlettered people that weren't dependent on enlightened nations, representatives skilled in diplomacy, masters of a written language, or understanding modes and forms of creating various technical estates. The Common is an essential part of any group any time in the history of man. When the first people gathered around a fire to cook, share and exchange their food and stories of the hunt and the days adventures, to find a mate, to make friends, etc., there was a common, and there were rules of behavior for all.
Even children understand the concept. They know the difference between mom and dad's bedroom and the kitchen on one hand and the bath, dining, family, and living rooms on the other. When they first are on the playground at school, they learn to share the slide, merry-go-round, and swings in common with the other children. They quickly learn the common has rules. (Did I just uncover the real reason why playgrounds can't have such wonderful things anymore?). Are such children lettered?
The limitations of the Chinook language are too important to Boldt. He does not mention sign language. Have you ever played "Charades" or just watched others. Lots of information can be conveyed. How hard is it to point at everyone present for the treaty and make a big sweeping inclusive motion? Many Indians had seen explorers' ships and even the explorers since 1805 when Lewis and Clark came as far as Astoria. A fort was built there in 1813. There were numerous settlers in Seattle, Olympia, and probably elsewhere years before the treaty was signed in 1855. How much English did some Indians already know? I suspect more than Boldt and the plaintifs want us to believe.
Surely, the Indians must have recognized the fact that the reservation was their designated common area just for them. Shouldn't that make it obvious to them that the rest was the common area for everyone else and them? How difficult is that to see? It follows naturally and logically. I don't see the Indians as so primitive that this would be difficult for them.
Indians always talk about how their elders are wise and how much they honor and respect them. Yet, some 120 years after the signing, some unhappy tribal members were willing and anxious to throw their ancestors under the bus, and Judge Boldt swallowed.
Article 10 of the treaty makes a lie of the whole case. The tribes were desirous of alcohol prohibition on the reservations. This is all the evidence needed to conclude they knew what The Common was and it needed rules to protect it.
Article 9 also has something about The Common shared by all. Two rules for the Indians when on the joint commons: be friendly and respect property.
End of Part 1.
Well now I just want to start watering my lawn.
Go for it.
Question? Before there were irrigation ditches for farming, where, how, was the water table in Sequim Valley and town rechraged, naturally? I have understood from books, lectures, and stories that it used to be a desert in the dry season. It would seem logical to me that if farmers and residents irrigate that that would recharge the subsurface water table as well as use of home wells and septic systems. Borrowing from the creek and river to give trees and veggies a drink (farming) should use only a portion of the water that we give to plants and bathe in, and the rest goes back into the ground, sort of redistribution of the water . Not so? Metering wells and water use to keep track of the source and use seems smart to me,. Is there an amount of water that irrigators can take or totally unregulated? That sounds bad. How about a factual news article about these uses.
My Great Grandfather and a few others brought the water from the river to the valley back in the 1800's and I am sad to see what is happening to the open ditches? And all you newbys need to study the history of this valley and its growth?
I'd ask that you educate the masses here where more can learn than individually trying to track down the history if that makes sense. The perspectives you have likely aren't documented anywhere.
https://irrigationfestival.com/site/history/
Go to this website and you will learn a lot!
MK: Just go to the local museum and learn it there?
I have always asked: How is it wasting water if the water seeps back into the ground and is filtered down to the water table, or is evaporated into the atmosphere to become precipitation? If you want to "go green" you need to "grow green."
The irrigation ditches from a "alluvium"/ mineral distribution standpoint were the backbone of our grandparents food supply. Now we have genetically altered crops grown in "no til" farms. Our bodies immune system requires minerals. The best way to cull a population, is to control the food and take out the things our immune system needs so we can get sicker and have no defenses for the worst they can engineer in a lab.
If clallam county is going to continue to invent new groups like charter review,conservation,water districts,water stewardship,ect ect ect then you can bet these groups will come up with new permits and raised fee's to pass their time.
If the County Commissioners cut their funding, that is quite telling based on some of their spending to help addicts prolong their addiction.
While living in Eastern Washington subscribed to and read the Capital Press. Back then, a decade ago, the worry was that the Odessa subarea aquifer was being drained due to heavy agricultural demand for water combined with a lack of rainfall, "the well is running dry folks". Just read a report that a META datacenter (built in Georgia) uses about 500,000 gallons of water a day. "Water, water, everywhere and not a drop to drink." Nor a drop for our crops/gardens? Maybe there is an opportunity for the community (no, not a politically partisan water steward) as a whole to forge a plan. I think the Sunny Farms store has its farm area in the Odessa Aquifer area.